FRAN KELLY:                          The Opposition’s spokesman on climate change, Andrew Robb has been in China for the past five days. He’s been there for meetings on climate change but he says the allegations against the Rio Tinto staff have been page one news everyday in Beijing and he says in contrast the Australia Government response looks quote “timid and weak”, I spoke with Andrew Robb last night from Hong Kong.

 

ANDREW ROBB:                     Well Kevin Rudd has been tugging his forelock for ten days there’s been a megaphone operating up here in China. For the five days I have been in china its been pushed as the number one story on state run media everywhere and increasingly strident accusations of wide spread bribery and espionage involving Rio Tinto and demands for regulations of foreign interests, its cranked up each day and it seems like a very deliberate attempt to escalate the issue at least in China.

 

FRAN KELLY:                           And what have you read into that or what have you been, any hints you have been given on what that the escalation might be about?

 

ANDREW ROBB:                    No, I am not well placed to know what all that’s about but I must say though I thought the Australian Government response has looked extremely timid and weak and really provided zero defence of a great Australian company. I don’t any of the details of course of the case but I did some work with Rio Tinto before entering Parliament and I found the company had very strict ethical policies for bidding bribery and this needs to be said at the very least and it’s not being said and It didn’t come through in China and needs to be said. It needs to be presented before the Chinese people, you know at least the clarification of the nature of charges.

 

FRAN KELLY:                           Are you getting that sense, is there any sort commentary anywhere in any of the media you have been reading there about Australia’s response being weak?

ANDREW ROBB:                    No, there is just been very little other than to say that the Australian Government is going to treat this with caution and whatever has been the statement over the last five or tens days. You know it’s been said that it’s a matter of state secret but state run media have been clearly being briefed from senior officials and there has been a deliberate attempt I think to really raise the temperate on this issue very stridently and strongly and Australian companies are in the firing line.

 

FRAN KELLY:                          You have been having discussions with Chinese officials and Chinese business executives has the Hu issue been raised directly with you in any of these meetings?

 

ANDREW ROBB:                     No only in the context of that we have do have differences on issues but again they’ve been people with a prime responsibility for climate and energy and those sorts of issues and it hasn’t been appropriate to pursue this issue.

 

FRAN KELLY:                          Andrew Robb lets move onto climate change because you spent five days of your trip there in climate change talks. China is pretty well the ace in the pack for a global deal on global warming what did you learn there? What level were you having talks and what did learn about china’s intentions?

ANDREW ROBB:                    Well I had talks at the most senior levels I had the director generals of the Departments who were running all matters to do with the Copenhagen talks and to do with their own programme to deal with climate change I think Copenhagen hinges critically on the US and China, not just china, the US and china they represent nearly 50 per cent of all emissions. My experience with Washington a few days before and then with China is that both countries are still miles apart in many respects and I think the key element is that trust is missing, there is still a lot of suspicion from both countries. In the US, people think China will use climate change to take technology and their industries and their jobs. And in China people think the US will force a cost on their energy which will slow growth and hold them back and stop them from getting hundreds of millions more people out of poverty. So you’ve got this essential distrust which both countries are seeking to deal with and I think it does make it fairly problematic that there’ll be any sort of detailed road map or plan coming out of Copenhagen.

FRAN KELLY:                          Given that mistrust then, it sounds like you didn’t get much sense that China is committed to an ambitious deal at Copenhagen or any deal at Copenhagen, is that the feeling you got?

 

 

 

 

It just underscores, you know, the common sense in fact, of the Rudd Government taking a big deep breath, holding back a vote on their emissions trading scheme until the US, you know, gets close to finalising a bill because at the moment the US Bill would result in Australia being far less competitive, even against the United States. 

 

We must walk in step with the big countries. If we get ahead the rest of the world, especially countries like the United States, it is just an enormous damage to Australia unnecessarily. Tens of thousands of jobs and the irony is that the scheme currently we’re debating will do little or nothing about CO2 emissions. There’s a lot of work to be done to get this scheme right, if we are to move in lock step with the rest of the world.

 

FRAN KELLY:                           From what you’re saying, well I mean all the signs are, that the world is not moving anywhere much lock step or not. But from what you’re saying, you’d agree then with the comments made as an aside by the Prime Minister at the G8 meeting recently where he was overheard saying, I don’t think we’re on track for an agreement at Copenhagen.