01-February-2012
Portfolio Media Releases
Topics: Labor’s leadership crisis, the economy, political donations
E&OE...
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Can I welcome Andrew Robb in Canberra, good afternoon.
ANDREW ROBB:
Good afternoon, Rafael, and congratulations on your new job.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Thank you, I’m having fun so far. Nicola Roxon is in the studio with us in Melbourne.
NICOLA ROXON:
Hello, Hi Andrew
ANDREW ROBB:
Hi Nicola
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Look Andrew, can I ask you before I sort of ask you to take strips off the Government, can you tell people, firstly, what suburbs your seat covers in Melbourne so they have some idea of where you’re coming from, and I want to ask both of you too, give us a bit of an indication what your days have been like this week.
I’m not sort of, I don’t want this to be a competitive thing, but I do really just want to give people a bit of an idea of what your days’ are actually like; what you spend your days doing. So Andrew, first, if you just tell us the seat you represent and what your average day is like.
ANDREW ROBB:
Ok, well my seat’s on the bay, a very great part of Melbourne, a beautiful part of Melbourne, from Gardenvale down to Beaumaris, and on the other side of the Highway, from Bentleigh, South Caulfield, those suburbs around there, about 17 suburbs, some full suburbs, some half suburbs, so there’s about 140,000 people, 50 schools, 25 primary, 25 secondary, and a typical community. 908 community organisations, and on my reckoning, about 35 to 40,000 volunteers amongst those 140,000 who make our community function.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
And tell us about your day.
ANDREW ROBB:
Your days, well you’ve really got three jobs as a politician. One is to try and represent the local communities, so weekends in particular you’ve got a lot of local events where you’re going along and sometimes presenting something, a lot of times just being there and talking to people, representing their interests on problems.
Another part of your job is Parliament so we’ve got about 20 weeks of the year where we sit in Canberra and that involves, I get here at 6 and leave at 10.30 usually at night
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
So, 6 til 10.30, how many days a week is that normally, seven?
ANDREW ROBB:
That’s four days in Canberra, we come up here for 20 weeks. We usually arrive on a Sunday night and we sit through til Thursday night
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
And when you’re in Melbourne is it still sort of 6 til 10.30 kind of work?
ANDREW ROBB:
Well, I get up and swim in the bay in the mornings
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Right, which beach do you swim at?
ANDREW ROBB:
At Brighton, at the baths there, in the bay, and with the ‘Icebergers’, and usually, the thing is, with a lot of our jobs if we’re not in Canberra and debating things in the parliament, and it rises about 10 o’clock at night, many of us, especially the senior ones who are out addressing different organisations, you get endless invitations to make speeches, and the third area of course is if you’ve got a ministry or a shadow ministry.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
And I want to get on to one of your jobs is collating all the policies for the Coalition, so we’ll get onto that in a moment. I just wanted to give Nicola Roxon an opportunity, tell us the suburbs you represent and your day is like as a Federal Minister.
NICOLA ROXON:
Interestingly, I’m on the other side of the bay, so the inner west suburbs is the area that I represent, sort of from the south in Williamstown to the north up in Maribyrnong. My office is up in Maribyrnong up near Highpoint shopping centre. Then I go west out towards Altona, and parts of, all of the communities in between Spotswood, Newport, Yarraville, I won’t try to list them all.
It’s a very, now a growing, changing residential area but it still has a very big industrial heart. A little bit of a different mix of communities, a very strong ethic mix compared maybe to the communities that Andrew’s representing, although the mix is everywhere in Melbourne and something that is good about Melbourne.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
But you are a much more traditional Labor heartland seat whereas Andrew might be a bit more –
NICOLA ROXON:
Yes, we sort of look at each other across the bay, we give each other a bit of fright every now and again in Parliament because we both swim in the mornings. I don’t reckon I’m as good a swimmer as he is but its doing me good and I certainly wouldn’t swim in the bay in the mornings – it’d be way too cold for me, I’m a bit more comfortable than that.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
No, no it’s good for you. What are you hours like as a Federal Minister?
NICOLA ROXON:
They’re pretty similar to what Andrew was talking about I’ve for example spent all of Monday in Canberra. We had a lot of cabinet meetings, a lot catching up with new ministers, because I’m in a new portfolio, its now working out how my job overlaps with other people because you do so much together, had a big dinner at the High Court because all the new silks were being announced, met with a lot of judges and other people. Yesterday I was in Sydney, we were opening some new court buildings, again a lot of lawyers and Judges, which is part of my new role.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Can I ask, when you are doing things like that, not that those things aren’t important, but you’re a political animal do you often find yourself doing the, I don’t know, the more ceremonial aspects of your job and you’re thinking, ‘oh god’, I need to get back and get across this policy brief because I really need to ram home a political point tomorrow. Do you… are those things a distraction or are they the political bits?
NICOLA ROXON:
Well… no I reckon politics is really good for people who like to do more than one thing at a time, I think it would be a nightmare if you always wanted to be focused on one thing because you just don’t have that luxury and it’s a pretty big deal when you get to open new facilities that are going to really change the way courts can operate and that’s part of my job. But most of my days do mix with other things as well but in a new portfolio you are always meeting a whole lot of people in the first period.
Today I’ve been in the electorate and I’ve been doing a lot of briefs and I’ve been stuck in some Melbourne traffic and thank you to your traffic presenter for letting me avoid some of that. Nearly missed you Andrew, and that would have been a bad start. So they can be pretty long days. On the other no one is making us do this, I love the job and what I’m doing.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Oh no, just want to give people an idea about what you do.
NICOLA ROXON:
We worked last Sunday because the New Zealand Justice Minister and the New Zealand Premier were here. I’m working this Sunday because we are doing some things with our backbenchers that Julia has organised.
So it does cut into a lot of time. I’m coming back on Sunday night, taking my daughter to school for her first day of school for Grade 2, and then flying back to Canberra again, so you do end up doing that because you want to not miss those big occasions and that’s a challenge that we all face.
RAFAEL EPTSTEIN:
OK, let’s get down to it, I suppose Andrew Robb you are being asked if you swim with Ted Baillieu, I’ll let you answer that question later because I think you do. But I want to get down to an obvious elephant in the room question for a Federal Labor minister, if your poll numbers continue at 30 per cent isn’t it inevitable there’s going to be a leadership stoush?
NICOLA ROXON:
Well I don’t think so, I think obviously want our polling numbers to improve, I don’t think that at this stage the community and you know I’m not blaming the community, I think this is a problem for us, has fully understood the rage of things the government has done. I think the Opposition has been very effected in highlighting some problems but I think it’s got way out of proportion to actually the good work and you know the case today, the equal pay case would never have happened if we hadn’t been elected if we hadn’t changed the laws and if we hadn’t allowed such a case to be brought and I think ultimately…
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
You got rid of Kevin Rudd though with higher numbers and he won an election ..
NICOLA ROXON:
But, sure -
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Isn’t the leadership battle within your party room inevitable?
NICOLA ROXON:
Well I don’t it’s inevitable because I don’t it’s what will change the situation, what I think will change the situation is when we can get enough focus in the community on the things we are actually working hard to deliver and that are starting to provide benefits to the community. I personally think Julia is the best person to do that, she’s had a pretty rough trot and I know obviously people can make all sorts of comments about whether she can effectively lead us. I don’t think focussing on the leadership fixes that challenge.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Has Kevin Rudd done enough to kill off any speculation of leadership?
NICOLA ROXON:
Look, I think it is unfortunate that this just keeps being an issue. I don’t think it’s good for the party, I think it would be great if Kevin ruled out that he ever wants to be prime minister again, but I don’t think that he’s likely to do that.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Do you think he should? It would make a huge difference because every time you do an interview or any minister you get asked about it.
NICOLA ROXON:
Of course I think he should. I think he’s being a good foreign minister, I think that he should focus on that. I think we’ve all got a role to play within the team, but as I say I don’t think that is going to happen it’s just something that we have to live with. Obviously it’s an unusual situation to have a former prime minister in such an important role within the government. I think it would be best if he put all of his skills to that -
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
So you are saying he’s not putting all his skills to that?
NICOLA ROXON:
Well, I think this debate and your question is implying he should do more to rule out any leadership challenge, I think the Labor Party needs to focus on what we are delivering in government. We don’t want to keep talking about leadership, I know you want to and Andrew and others want to and maybe people in the community want to, but that is actually not what is going to help the government deliver things and it’s frustrating to us when we know so many good things are happening.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Andrew Robb, Nicola Roxon could reel off any number of policy achievements, the verdict on the economy from the markets are pretty good, the Aussie dollar is high, bond yields for government borrowing the cost for the government to borrow money are at near record lows, they’re doing a pretty good job aren’t they?
ANDREW ROBB:
Well, you just have to talk to people, part of what Nicola talked about, getting out and mixing with the community, which, unless you like that sort of work, don’t enter politics, but you do get a keen sense of the mood.
I must say, I think there’s no dispute that there’s some sort of crisis of confidence that is really permeating so much of the community. It is the reason people aren’t spending dollars.
It is the reason that in the last twelve months, the Australian community has been saving about up to thirteen percent of their disposable income, when normally we save about one percent, so –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
But it’s a confected crisis, isn’t it? I mean, you can reel off any number of great statistics about the economy, including the fact that the tax take is smaller under this government than it was under the Howard Government, you’re –
ANDREW ROBB:
Well, but that’s an illusion in the sense that, if you’re going to spend money, you can do it either by increasing taxes, or borrowing, and this Government has got the highest debt that we’ve ever had in our lifetime, by any government, and yet they took over four years ago with zero debt, so it’s really –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
We’ve also got some of the best unemployment figures –
ANDREW ROBB:
–it’s deferred taxation.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
We’ve got some of the best unemployment figures, and some of the best debt cost figures after a downturn that Australia’s ever had. I mean, there’s two sides to that coin, isn’t there? Look, the issue is –
ANDREW ROBB:
We went in also –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
– whether or not you’re focussing too much on, or the media is focussing too much on the issue, and we don’t hear enough about genuine economic outcomes.
ANDREW ROBB:
Well again, we’re driven by the community sentiment, in many respects. In politics you are trying to address things that are of concern to people. There’s been a dramatic increase in electricity prices, in water prices, in rates, and on top of that, overlaying all that, I think there is a very keen sense that people don’t feel that, they don’t see the economy going anywhere, they don’t see the government going anywhere, they don’t understand or get any sense of where the economy is being taken by Julia Gillard, and in many respects, the issue you just dealt with, with Nicola, is a reflection of that, and Kevin Rudd today, while the prime minister’s trying to make her first major speech for the year, coincidentally he calls a press conference in Queensland –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Yeah, I was watching that –
ANDREW ROBB:
– and coincidentally Sky News is there, and they’re cutting to Kevin –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
– and they stuffed that up on the box. Look, we will get back to this after the news.
(News break)
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Andrew Robb was mentioning before the news that Kevin Rudd conveniently managed to announce, to hold a press conference just as Julia Gillard was finishing which allowed both the 24-hour news channels to juxtapose his press conference with the Prime Minister’s speech – her first big set speech of the year. We will just have a quick listen at what Kevin Rudd had to say after Nicola Roxon’s been telling us that maybe he needs to dampen down this leadership speculation a little bit more.
KEVIN RUDD (RECORDING):
We’re all members of a ministerial team and it’s a pretty hard working team. I work with these women and men every day, every week, every month, and I have done for the last 18 months or so, and it’s a solid, strong team which Simon himself is a very strong, positive contributor, and where I seek to play my own part as well, and intend to continue to do so.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
That’s a reference obviously to Simon Crean, the other senior minister who is asking Kevin Rudd to back off a little. I’m sure that will come up again but I do want to raise with both Andrew Robb, the Shadow Minister for Finance, who’s joined us from Canberra and Nicola Roxon, the Attorney General, the Australian Electoral Commission put out their returns today, on donations to political parties.
The Liberal/National Party is a little bit ahead on $121 million, the ALP receiving $93 million. The significant thing about the AEC returns is we find out a little bit about who is funding our political parties. I can tell you that when I was at The Age for a couple of years, trying to track down the finances, who gives what money to which political party is incredibly difficult. I spent hours and hours on phones trying to track that down, and I have to say it was almost a spectacular failure some of the time. I would like to know from both of you though, do we have enough transparency, Nicola Roxon, in our donation laws to political parties.
NICOLA ROXON:
Well look I think when you look at what happens in Australia compared to around the world we have a lot of transparency, the problem is we don’t have it in a very timely way.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Yes
NICOLA ROXON:
So we’re finding out now about the expenditure during the election campaign and we’re finding out, as I’ve been talking about for a long period of time, that again, hundreds of thousands of dollars came from big tobacco companies to the Liberal Party, of course the Labor Party stopped doing that in 2004.
One of the surprises for us, though, that you also find out is you find out who has spent money directly themselves in trying to influence the political process, and we’ve uncovered the staggering figures of now nearly $14 million being spent by tobacco companies, hundreds of thousands of that to the Liberal Party but the rest directly campaigning against our government’s plain packaging laws. A huge amount, in fact we put a release out saying nearly $5 million, it was only hours later that again, sifting through that material, that we found the amount that was spent for some of the other advertising campaigns.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
But, I mean, it’s a free country. If people have money, and the mining companies want to run an advertising campaign against you, there is nothing wrong with them doing that. Isn’t the real issue, and I hate to keep going back to this, is that your former prime minister, Kevin Rudd and Julia Gillard now, don’t seem that adept at battling back against those big advertising campaigns?
NICOLA ROXON:
Well I think there is a broader question, of course, in the public arena, we can fight it out in the media and others, and we use paid media during the campaign, but I think people are very uncomfortable with what big, wealthy companies can afford to do in our political system. Because we have public financing its not as obvious as you might see in America.
I mean, you’ve heard Newt Gingrich today talking about wanting people power instead of money power, you know the same thing from the opposite could be said here, and I just think that people are uncomfortable with the scale of money that is being put in by these companies, particularly when there are no redeeming features for tobacco companies, mining companies bring a lot of wealth and a lot of benefit and a lot of employment, and without any of the health damages.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Andrew Robb, is it OK for the Coalition to accept donations from tobacco companies?
ANDREW ROBB:
Well our view is that there are companies that are legally established in our country, it is a free country, and once you start to discriminate against all sorts of groups that you mightn’t agree with their product –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Is it discrimination to not take money from a tobacco company, would you class that as discrimination?
ANDREW ROBB:
Well once you start to exclude legal organisations within our community from participating in the democratic process – you see that plain packaging, despite all the money they spent, it went through, and went through without support.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Despite all the money the tobacco companies spent?
ANDREW ROBB:
Yeah, so, we’re capable of making a decision, so is the Labor Party, and it’s a funny thing to talk about people being concerned by big companies, but one, they actually employ hundreds of thousands of people, in the case of miners and others, and the other thing is that the union movement continues to contribute millions of dollars, not only to the Labor Party, but separately in their own campaigns. They are a monolith –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
So you’re saying it’s a free fight, people give money to either side that they support, and –
ANDREW ROBB:
Well they do, and –
NICOLA ROXON:
And I think that would be a fair argument to make, I do think that there are some exceptional circumstances, and many of Andrew Robb’s Liberal colleagues in State Government have already refused to accept donations from companies, so this is not just a split straight down Labor/Liberal lines – it is federally – but you’ve seen other Liberal leaders prepared to say, look, tobacco kills thousands of Australians every year, we can make an exception here, there’s nothing good about tobacco, and in those circumstances where they’re trying to buy political influence, it would be better for us to be able to be really clear to the world that our decisions are just based on our own views, and are not influenced by that money, and I think that’s something that Mr Abbott and Mr Robb will have to really focus on when parliament returns.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
I’ll give you both –
ANDREW ROBB:
Well I think how we vote is a pretty good indicator of that, so –
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Okay, Andrew and Nicola, I want to give you both thirty seconds. Both of your leaders have given big speeches yesterday and today, Andrew Robb, thirty seconds on what you thought of Tony Abbott’s speech yesterday.
ANDREW ROBB:
Well his job is to map out what the government is doing wrong, which I think he did very well, and also, give people a sense of where our priorities are, which is to have a smaller government, live within our means, reverse the nanny state, and I thought he did that extremely well, and he has been congratulated and applauded by all sorts of commentators, including Laurie Oakes.
RAFAEL EPSTEIN:
Nicola Roxon, Julia Gillard in Melbourne today giving her first set speech for the year?
NICOLA ROXON:
Well look, in stark contrast, there was a big new idea, a proposal that those who are going to TAFE college, want to get their apprenticeships and others, shouldn’t have to pay upfront fees, and a proposal to introduce a scheme where they can get that money paid, and then pay it back over time when they’re employed, like our HECS scheme, this is a big idea, it’s important for education and for the economy, and was in a very big contrast to Mr Abbott not having any ideas that he’s put forward for debate.
ANDREW ROBB:
Okay, we’ll see if we can bring you more of Nicola Roxon and Andrew Robb over the next few weeks and months. I want to thank them both for coming along and joining ‘Fight Club’, thank you.
NICOLA ROXON:
Thank you.
ANDREW ROBB:
Good on you, thanks Rafael.
ENDS